I appreciate your approach. No offense taken. I think at times because I state things in a “declarative” manner it comes across as I’m presenting some all-out truth. I mean, if I’m giving myself some time, I could argue that whites are responsible for under 30% of murders, not 35%. Read on, and I will explain.

I’m not the arbiter of truth, but at the same time, I would ask if there’s any particular aspect one can debunk. I have yet to find that FBI stats on arrests don’t align with victim rates, or stats for perpetrators.

You talked much about how many murders we don’t know about. Which unlike rape, aggravated assault, and other forms of violence where we do know the perpetrator, many are unsolved. But we do know:

1. How many died; and

2. The approximate percentage of intracial homicide, i.e. whites killings whites, blacks killing blacks.

So let’s start with what we know, and if you don’t agree, let me know:

* Homicide and crime is mostly intraracial: “1980 through 2008–84% of white victims were killed by whites. 93% of black victims were killed by blacks.”

* “The Hispanic homicide victimization rate in 2010 was 5.73 per 100,000; white = 2.52 per 100,000; black = 19.47 per 100,000)”

Violence Policy Center using CDC data —

With above numbers and census breakdown by race/ethnicity, I calculated the following whole numbers. The rates may be slightly high, ‘cos the arithmetic comes to around 17,000 and not CDC’s 16,161; but this is close, and surprisingly difficult to find broken down anywhere:

White — 62% of population (5000); Hispanic- 17% (3000); Black 13% (8000); Asian 5.6 % + .9% Native American + .5% — Pacific Islander (800–1000)

OR if one needs more proof:

* “African Americans are 52.2% of arrests for homicides” (FBI linked source in Wikipedia:

* “50% off murder victims were black”


THUS, wouldn’t you say that given the fact that if A. We know the % of people who die, and B. That we know approximately the % of people who kill intracially based on historical and U.S. Dept. of Justice data (and common sense; we kill who we know), then C. Wouldn’t we have a good ball-park in understanding how White people would be responsible for about 35% of the homicides? That may be a “high” mark because based on my homicide victimization rate above (5000 divided by 17,000), whites are 29% of those killed. And because white folks kill outside their racial group far less than black folks in the USA (84% to 93%, says the Department of Justice), then maybe they’re responsible for an even smaller percentage.

Racial justice-minded persons reading may have to take a pause. And a reminder: Racists, go drink a Coors Light and chill — this all came from slavery and likely your ancestors bigotry.

Then again, anybody can go to the FBI 2015 “arrest” figures and explain to me that in a city like mine (Chicago) where the murder clearance rate is around 30% and nearly 80% of the victims are black that say “far too many” black people are being arrested as suspects for homicide? Maybe. But that defies logic. More likely, far “too few blacks” are being arrested in major cities because the citizens have lost faith with police. Sadly, a “Ferguson Effect” may be taking place — some say “snitching” and lack of trust with police is limiting cooperation. One doesn’t have to be a conservative mouthpiece to state based on that FBI data:

But we also have:

Thus, we MAY have roughly 25–29% of people arrested for murder or manslaughter who are white, not 35%. Does that work better?

And according to your logic that we don’t have good records on dropped charges, how does that factor into knowing (generally) who is killed?

I wouldn’t say I have the methodology entirely correct, but I believe I have a good start. And a stronger “ball park” number than anyone else out there. And, for some reason, the FBI doesn’t want to disassemble “white” from Hispanic/Latino themselves.


Early in my analysis, I found an alarming fact in the FBI records, which certainly racists drumbeat to death. In a single victim, single offender model:

* 409 whites killed by blacks in 2013 (known perpetrator)

* 189 blacks killed by whites in 2013 (known perpetrator)

And again, police kill 500 white people (representing 10% of “white annual homicides”) and nearly 250 black people (representing 4% of “black annual homicides”).

Remind me: How is racism killing people of color again? And who should we be afraid of when walking down the street? (I’d argue, nobody, ‘cos homicide is fairly rare and criminality comes from a minuscule % of the population, no matter the race. But I keep hearing that people are getting shot and killed by simply for being black.)

LINE 5 = Data Table 6 in this report “Race, Ethnicity, and Sex of Victim by Race, Ethnicity, and Sex of Offender, 2013”:




Writer. Researcher. Designer. Human seeking better outcomes. Also searching for relevant facts and logical arguments above expedient or politial narratives.

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David Shuey

David Shuey

Writer. Researcher. Designer. Human seeking better outcomes. Also searching for relevant facts and logical arguments above expedient or politial narratives.

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